Comments on: Terms I never want to hear again http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/ Wed, 07 Jan 2009 04:36:32 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.2.1 By: Bruce/Crablaw http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-335 Bruce/Crablaw Wed, 01 Aug 2007 04:20:52 +0000 http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-335 Zuzu, bravo. They say that God was created in man's image, but the peculiarly American penchant for aggressive civil religion narcissism confounds not only philosophic value or religious meaning, but any decent sense of aesthetics as well. It makes one perhaps appreciate the Roman Catholic doctrine of Papal infallibility; by implication, everything else may be fallible. But the odd American fusion of Bible Christianity and what sociologists call "civil religion" regresses towards tasteless, unspeakably obnoxious and tacky narcissism and the "my country right or wrong" infallibility instinct on which President Codpiece depends for his political survival, such as it may be. Zuzu, bravo.

They say that God was created in man’s image, but the peculiarly American penchant for aggressive civil religion narcissism confounds not only philosophic value or religious meaning, but any decent sense of aesthetics as well. It makes one perhaps appreciate the Roman Catholic doctrine of Papal infallibility; by implication, everything else may be fallible. But the odd American fusion of Bible Christianity and what sociologists call “civil religion” regresses towards tasteless, unspeakably obnoxious and tacky narcissism and the “my country right or wrong” infallibility instinct on which President Codpiece depends for his political survival, such as it may be.

]]> By: Pockysmama http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-321 Pockysmama Tue, 31 Jul 2007 14:21:04 +0000 http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-321 Can we also retire: premarital sex (if you aren't getting married, how can you have premarital sex?) gay marriage (this one really, really irks me. I made my friends stop saying that by saying things like hetero marriage, black marriage, hispanic marriage to prove how stupid it sounds) Can we also retire:

premarital sex (if you aren’t getting married, how can you have premarital sex?)

gay marriage (this one really, really irks me. I made my friends stop saying that by saying things like hetero marriage, black marriage, hispanic marriage to prove how stupid it sounds)

]]> By: Zuzu http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-309 Zuzu Tue, 31 Jul 2007 02:26:54 +0000 http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-309 And where am I "attacking" Vegas weddings, Elaine? And where am I “attacking” Vegas weddings, Elaine?

]]> By: Elaine Vigneault http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-307 Elaine Vigneault Tue, 31 Jul 2007 01:51:43 +0000 http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-307 As a former Nevada resident who had a Vegas wedding I must remind you that Las Vegas has been transforming marriage for years now and the conservatives know it. Nevada was one of the first states to legalize interracial marriage. And of course, Vegas offers a wide variety of non-traditional weddings. Please, please, please do not attack Vegas weddings to prove a point. Vegas gets enough crap from the religious right for all the family planning clinics and gambling. The blue county doesn't need more crap from the left, too. As a former Nevada resident who had a Vegas wedding I must remind you that Las Vegas has been transforming marriage for years now and the conservatives know it. Nevada was one of the first states to legalize interracial marriage. And of course, Vegas offers a wide variety of non-traditional weddings.

Please, please, please do not attack Vegas weddings to prove a point. Vegas gets enough crap from the religious right for all the family planning clinics and gambling. The blue county doesn’t need more crap from the left, too.

]]> By: Blue Dog http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-291 Blue Dog Mon, 30 Jul 2007 14:52:33 +0000 http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-291 This was an excellent post. Your recognition that "marriage, as far as the state is concerned, is a bundle of rights and responsibilities" is key. People need to understand that the state cannot give marriage value, you have to give your marriage value. The state cannot make you raise good kids, take care of your loved one if he or she is ill, or be a good partner. The state cannot make you stay together. If we allow same-sex couples to marry, this has nothing to do with the spiritual side of marriage or what a person's church may recognize. It's the same for a flag, the flag is a symbol, it is not the reality. And the symbol is of a country that has a Constitution that recognizes free speech and allows dissent, even ugly dissent. Anyway, good post. This was an excellent post. Your recognition that “marriage, as far as the state is concerned, is a bundle of rights and responsibilities” is key. People need to understand that the state cannot give marriage value, you have to give your marriage value. The state cannot make you raise good kids, take care of your loved one if he or she is ill, or be a good partner. The state cannot make you stay together. If we allow same-sex couples to marry, this has nothing to do with the spiritual side of marriage or what a person’s church may recognize. It’s the same for a flag, the flag is a symbol, it is not the reality. And the symbol is of a country that has a Constitution that recognizes free speech and allows dissent, even ugly dissent. Anyway, good post.

]]> By: Roy http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-289 Roy Mon, 30 Jul 2007 13:59:31 +0000 http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-289 <b>And the fun part is that the people who are most upset by “desecration” of the flag seem to have the least regard for the ideals which the flag is supposed to represent.</b> They're also the least likely to have any actually respect for the flag, as the photo you selected shows. Ugh. I'm so bleeding tired of seeing people moan and whine about how <i>sacred</i> the flag is, but then you'll see them wearing something like that, or with a plastic flag flying on their car, or decals with the flag stuck in the back window. Unsurprisingly, it's only important to hold the flag sacred when it's being displayed in a way they don't like. And the fun part is that the people who are most upset by “desecration” of the flag seem to have the least regard for the ideals which the flag is supposed to represent.

They’re also the least likely to have any actually respect for the flag, as the photo you selected shows. Ugh. I’m so bleeding tired of seeing people moan and whine about how sacred the flag is, but then you’ll see them wearing something like that, or with a plastic flag flying on their car, or decals with the flag stuck in the back window. Unsurprisingly, it’s only important to hold the flag sacred when it’s being displayed in a way they don’t like.

]]> By: B.D. http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-287 B.D. Mon, 30 Jul 2007 13:31:01 +0000 http://kindlypogmothoin.com/2007/07/29/terms-i-never-want-to-hear-again/#comment-287 Good post. The freedom to dissent will be even louder from those who would protect the so-called sanctity of the flag if the next president is a Democrat (and particularly if the Congress remains in the Democrat's hands). They love dissent as long as it's their dissent. That's part of the problem - an unwillingness to accept a difference of opinion coupled with a desire to control. As for the so-called sanctity of marriage folks, religious faiths do not agree that marriage is exclusively heterosexual. There are religious leaders and communities that think marriage should be more inclusive. Imposing one religion's ideas over another is unconstitutional. I never see them debate this point. The argument is usually presented as all mainstream religions believe the same thing. Not only is that not true, but it still flies in the face of the Bill of Rights. Then again, I don't think the state should be involved in the marriage business. Let it stick to contract law and let religions fight it out in the market place of ideas who should be married in the eyes of gods. Good post. The freedom to dissent will be even louder from those who would protect the so-called sanctity of the flag if the next president is a Democrat (and particularly if the Congress remains in the Democrat’s hands). They love dissent as long as it’s their dissent. That’s part of the problem - an unwillingness to accept a difference of opinion coupled with a desire to control.

As for the so-called sanctity of marriage folks, religious faiths do not agree that marriage is exclusively heterosexual. There are religious leaders and communities that think marriage should be more inclusive. Imposing one religion’s ideas over another is unconstitutional. I never see them debate this point. The argument is usually presented as all mainstream religions believe the same thing. Not only is that not true, but it still flies in the face of the Bill of Rights.

Then again, I don’t think the state should be involved in the marriage business. Let it stick to contract law and let religions fight it out in the market place of ideas who should be married in the eyes of gods.

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